Yes, it is possible to canoe the entire Mississippi River. I have several web pages and many photos of my trip from Lake Itasca to the Gulf of Mexico at this link. Questions or comments? Please leave them here.
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Friday, July 20, 2007
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Greetings Buck. A few questions sir. I'm planning on canoeing the ohio river to the mississippi to the gulf. Is it suicide to do it without maps. Contacted the army corps and they will not have any to late august.Have some unexpected time off but time is of the essence. Also how well marked are dams and locks on the river. Is it possible to portage around say your on the other bank of the lock. Any advice is appreciated.
Ben
Hi Ben,
That sounds like a fun trip.
On my trip I had maps all the way to Cairo. I had arranged to have maps of the Lower Mississippi mailed to me there, but something went wrong and they never arrived. So from the confluence of the Ohio and the Mississippi I only had state highway maps, except for a map I had of the Mississippi river delta. That wasn't ideal, but to be truthful for a canoe it wasn't that big of a deal and I didn't have any trouble finding towns to get supplies.
I don't know about the Ohio, but on the Mississippi I had no problem seeing the locks and dams coming up far in the distance. Of course I was going very slow in my canoe.
I portaged around several locks and it was usually pretty easy. On a couple of them it was only maybe 30 feet.
When in doubt about how to do things, you can just stop and ask the lock operator. I found them to be very helpful and friendly. They seemed happy to help a guy in a canoe.
If you can't get your map books in time, you should be able to download them.
One more thought: there's got to be a lot of old Corps of Engineer Maps floating around. I'll bet if you called a few barge companies you could round up a set.
Just wondering what company(or companies) you used and how you arranged to send you canoe home?
What I did was get on the phone and call all the shipping companies I could find out of New Orleans. The quotes ranged from $300 to $3,000!
I don't remember who I shipped with, but it would pay to shop around, anyway. I'd suggest using the internet and phone to track down and compare several quotes. You'll want to know at least the length and weight of the canoe. How wide and big around would be useful, too.
Before planning to pay for your own way home and for shipping your canoe, give some consideration into seeing if any friends or family would be interested in driving down to New Orleans or Venice to pick you and your canoe up. You could pay for a lot of gas and other expenses for your friend and still save money.
I've gotten quite a few questions about rowing or sailing a canoe. I've never tried to row or sail a canoe, but have spent a lot of time rowing a raft. I think there's little question that rowing is more efficient than paddling, at least in most situations. On windy days on the Mississippi, I'd think about sailing. On my website I've got a picture of a couple of jolly fellows who had made their own canoe sail to use when conditions were right. It was crude, but it worked.
Anyway, if I were to do a long trip by canoe again, and I plan to, I'm going to take a hard look at rowing AND having a sail available. I did an internet search, and I found this site. They've got a canoe rowing setup, part of which can be used for a canoe sailing rig. Something to consider!
I've just added a new new page on my site showing my daily progress down the river. You might find this useful to get an idea of how long it might take you to travel between different points on the river.
Hello Buck,
I'm may be interested in trying the Mississippi next year. What size canoe did you use, and was it big enough or too small? How hard were the portages? I envision having to tote all this gear over vast distances. How does a portage work? Unload the canoe, move the canoe, move the equipmnet, reload the canoe? Your help is greatly appreciated.
Jim
Hi Jim,
I used a
17 foot canoe it was a good size for me but it's subjective. Most of the portages were quite easy. The longest was at Grand Rapids where there was a 1,200 yard portage. At times the Blandin Paper company will shuttle people around this spot but I don't know if they are still doing that. They were very nice to me but I ended up carrying my stuff anyway. Most portages are quite short and easy.
For a portage I'd unload the canoe, carry a load of gear as I scouted the route, get another load of gear, then carry the canoe. Portaging is one reason to carefully consider how much gear you're going to carry above the Twin Cities, and how heavy your canoe is.
Portages were work, for sure, but canoeing the Mississippi is a whole lot of work, and a whole lot of fun.
i loved your website buck. very helpful. i'm leaving from taylors falls on the st.croix sept 1 and will enter the river at prescott wisc. any idea how long it will take me since i'm avoiding the upper part of the river? will i freeze this time of year? do i have to bring maps? can't i just follow the channel markers? i'm broke and trying to do this as cheaply as possible. thanks again, your site is the best of several.
I've never canoed the lower St. Croix so I don't know how long that section will take. See the link I posted (above) showing my progress on the river, and I'll let you make your own estimate based on how long it took me.
That should be a very nice time of year to be on the river. The only time I got chilly on the river is when it was rainy and windy. You'll be heading south about as fast as the cool weather, so it shouldn't get too cold.
You can definitely do the trip without maps, but I recommend getting them. Following the markers is fairly easy, but it's nice to be able to easily locate towns, know exactly where you are on the river, and so on. I have a link where you can download free maps, above.
Good luck.
Hi, How did you ship your canoe home?
See my above answer. Good luck.
Thanks for the pictures and the breakdown of your trip. I am so excited about planning my trip down the Mississippi. Why did you choose a canoe over a kayak? I may buy a kayak and do the trip in that. I know that I will have to stop more often for food. How did you recharge your electronics, if you took any? How did you dock and leave you canoe to go into town? Did you just find good places to hide it?
Thanks for your advise.
Sam
Hi Sam,
Thanks for the post. The short answer on canoe vs. kayak is that I'd never used a kayak and had easy access to a borrowed canoe. Many people have used a kayak for the Mississippi.
I didn't burn too much electrical power, my GPS and radio used AA batteries and I just bought what I needed. Same with my camera.
When I went into town I always tried to hide my canoe where no one would see it, and carry my most valuable small items with me. I'd also lock my canoe to a tree with a lock and chain.
Have a good trip and let us know how it goes.
I just wanted to thank you for putting up such a useful site. My friend and I are about to leave for our Mississippi trip in a couple of days and your information has been a valuable resource. We'll be updating our website as we go along, http://www.threeleafmusic.com/log
Thanks again Buck!
Hi Chris,
I'm glad you found my site useful. That's a beautiful canoe you've built. Have a good trip!
Buck
What a great website about going down the Mississippi! My son and his friend are finishing up building a canoe, which they are going to take up to Minneapolis, and row/sail/coast down to the gulf. Do you know what the fishing licensing laws are for a trip like this? Did you ever fish for your meals? (I'm Chris's mom!)
I like to fish but I didn't fish on this trip. I believe the laws of the bordering state would apply as a person travels down the river. That's one reason I didn't fish. It would add to the fun, though, and I'm sure most states offer a temporary license.
1) I noticed that you were on the river on 9/11. What was that like and how did you react?
2) I regularly compete in bowfishing tournaments in the river near the Ohio River junction. The current there seems very frightening, even in my 28' steel boat. Did you have any near misses or frightening experiences in regard to the current?
3)Did you ever experience difficulty reaching the bank,navigating through locks and dams, or avoiding barges/towboats?
4)Was there ever a place where the river mud was too soft and dangerous to safely exit the river to strike camp?
5) What did you do about blisters?
1. Like everyone else, I'll never forget 9/11. I had turned on my radio and heard that the planes had hit and that all flights were being grounded. I suppose I felt much like most people, except I was largely out of touch with friends and family and didn't see any of the images on TV for a week or so.
2. For current, I encountered some serious swirls near the ends of wingdams and the like, but nothing that was particularly frightening. I think a real key is staying away from fixed objects where the worst currents are. My three most frightening times on the water were likely the day I paddled through the waves of Lake Bemidji, the day I paddled through the busy traffic of New Orleans on a windy day, with wind waves and boat wakes seemingly coming from all directions and with moored barges along both banks; and the morning I paddled out into the salt water of the Gulf and the growing swells started to feel spooky, when I turned around and headed for the beach, surfing my canoe on a good sized wave as I reached shore.
3. At the first lock I got out of my boat and talked to the lock master. He was very friendly and explained how it worked. After that it was pretty easy. Avoiding barges and boats wasn't a problem, but is potentially very dangerous if you don't pay close attention. The boat wakes weren't as bad in my experience as people had described.
4. I don't think I ever encountered a spot where the mud made it dangerous to reach shore or make camp. Of course, I did walk in mud many times, but at most camp spots the landing spot was pretty nice.
5. I don't recall getting any blisters. If I did they didn't amount to anything.
Hello,
I am looking for a place to meet my husband, who is kayaking from New York to New Orleans. He is almost finished with his trip - about a week away from New Orleans. Do you have any suggestions about where to meet, so that I can drive the van fairly close to the water and he can pull the kayak out of the water?
Thanks for your help.
Subagh
Hi Subagh,
There are undoubtedly several places in New Orleans that would work, but I only passed through once and don't know the city well enough to dirct you to them. Another alternate is Venice, which is at the "end of the road" and nearer the mouth of the river.
If your husband has a cell phone you might be able to arrive ahead of time, find your spot, then direct him to it.
Good luck!
Buck
Did you have any trouble with the rip current when you entered the Gulf of Mexico? What concerns did you have entering the ocean? What precautions should someone take when boating from the river into the ocean? How feasible is it to paddle along the ocean shore for a while in a canoe?
My experience paddling in the ocean at the mouth of the Mississippi was all of about 10 minutes, so I'm really not a good source of advice. The only thing I had trouble with was the waves building as I neared shore so I half "surfed" the boat in. That was actually one of the more tense moments of the trip.
If I were to do it again I'd either wait until the ocean was calm, or just canoe to the very mouth of the river and stop right there without actually canoeing out into the salt water.
I'm interested in canoeing Mississippi River and am looking for a partner. Do you have an suggestions in finding a partner? Are there any groups or organizations who might be interested?
Try this forum: http://www.paddling.net/message/
Best of luck,
Buck
Hi Buck! What was the water quality like on the river? Was it generally clean enough to get in and bathe along the way? thanks!
Hi, the river is cleaner than I thought it would be, so I did bathe in it several times. Martin Strel, an endurance swimmer, swam the whole Mississippi a few years ago!
I would get my drinking water in towns along the way.
Great! thanks! This is all very informative and encouraging :)
Myself and a group of 3 others have been working our way down the river in 7 day increments. This year we traded the canoe for a pontoon boat. I'm in charge of planning our campsites. In the past we stayed at the DNR sites. But this year I see there aren't as many thru Iowa and into Missouri. Did you camp at official sites or make your camp where you stopped for the night?
I had no trouble finding places to camp, and once I got beyond Minnesota I pretty much just looked for a nice out-of-the-way spot. It was usually pretty easy to find a spot. I would expect you would do fine pretty easily, too.
Have fun!
Buck
Great site. thanks for putting it together.
I am planning to kayak from lake Itasca to the Twin Cites in June.
I am a newbie to kayaking and long camping trips. How easy is it to get lost on the lakes and smaller sections of the river near the headwaters?
Do you have any recommendations for physical preparations for a trip like this?
Is this too big a trip for a novice? I am in decent shape and have done a lot of camping in my time but not to this extent.
Thanks for your insight!
-Scott Smith
Hi Scott,
On most of the river it's very easy to find your way. In only one spot did I have any real trouble but eventually located the current again. If you use maps and stay calm in those situations it will be no big deal and will just add to the adventure. Check out Google Earth for lakes near the headwaters.
If you pace yourself you won't need to be in great shape to do the river. The faster you'll need to travel the better shape you'll need to be in.
It's too big of a trip for a complete novice. You'll need to know how to control your boat. If you can control your boat, wear your life jacket, know how to camp and use common sense (not crossing the middle of the big lakes when there is any possibility of a big wind coming up, for example) it should be relatively safe.
Good luck!
Buck
www.bucktrack.com/AAA.html
What are the winds like on the Mississippi river? Whenever I go canoeing I have a hell of a time dealing with headwinds. Sometimes the winds will be stronger than the current and blow me backwards. Thanks for any information - Malcolm
The pictures are gone
Where did you camp along the river?
Hello Buck,
I just wanted to say thanks for all the advise. I plan on making a trip from Wisconsin down to New Orleans with a friend this fall to visit my cousin there. Your site has been a great source of information. I can't really think of many questions because most are answered but do you have any advise on good types of food to bring/buy along the way? I was thinking rice would work well. Any other suggestions? Thanks again,
-bert
Hi Folks,
I'm on the Continental Divide Trail and have a little while on the computer so I'll try to catch up.
Yes, I see some photos are gone. If they don't show up, it will have to wait until fall before I can replace them.
It was easy finding place to camp. I'd just find a nice, hidden spot well above the water. Often this was an island campsite.
Winds were strong, calm, and everything in between. Sometimes they were a problem but usually weren't too bad. I guess it's just one of those things to deal with when canoeing!
Rice is a good food to take. I've got a list of backpacking foods on this blog and other places on my website. Once you get below the Twin Cities where the portaging is pretty much over you can even bring canned goods.
Good luck everyone!
Buck
im a complete novice to the canoeing/kayaking world but crave an adventure such as this. however short on cash. what did the trip cost you roughly supplies n all. a ballpark figure. thanks again for your very useful and helpfull information
Hi shaker,
Thanks for the comment. A trip down the river can be very inexpensive or quite expensive, depending on how you live, just like normal life! I didn't stay in motels or spend time in riverside bars, so I'm guessing, guessing here now, that my total expenses ran less than $2,000.
Buck
Buck,
Enjoyed your site. I appreciate the resources that you have provided. I will be departing Lake Itasca on September 16, 2008 and expect to make New Orleans around mid November. If any other adventure paddlers are going to be on the Mississippi River during this time frame drop me an email.
You can follow my trip at iboattrack.com. Select: cruising boats, recent cruisers, Lone Star. There will be a discussion page link on the site.
Thanks again,
Robert
txsnapper@aol.com
My dad caught wind of your adventure on the river, and seeing he is such a kid at heart what better way to spend 2 months with your wife and daughter playing Huck Fin, right? Ive been doing my homework on this trip, but I wanted to know if this is something that takes a person being in good physical condt first and fore-most(Dads getting a bit gray). Second when is the ideal time to start this trip, as well as the condition of the river due to the hurricanes? Any help will be appreciated and used.
Shannon
Hi Shannon,
I think you should be healthy before starting the trip but you don't have to be in super good shape as long as you just pace yourself. I started in mid-August and that seemed like a good time to me. I really can't tell you how the river has been affected by the hurricanes.
Good luck!
Buck
Hey buck I just got back from my own solo mississippi river adventure. I started up in Itasca in aug.1 and 45 days later I found myself in near St. louis in a town called hamburg IL. unfortunatly thats where it had to end. The hurricane ike and another front flooded the river and it got a little dangerous. I hope someday ill be able to make the lower mississippi. Some people i met on the river tell me its not worth trying. What did you think of the lower portion, is it a whole new experiance from the still waters of the upper mississippi? Your website is the only reason I even made it to hamburg, cant thank you enough for the abundance of information that you gave me.
- Malcolm
A note to anyone attempting this: do not try to paddle across winnebigoshish, go along the edge. Things almost ended for me way out in the middle where the waves where taller than my canoe.
Hi Malcom,
I'm glad you got back safely from your adventure. Good comment on Lake Winnibigoshish! As I say on my website: "It was nearly 10 miles across as the crow flies. Crossing such a big lake in an open canoe is asking for trouble, and has killed many people through the years." Going along the shore is the way to go.
I'll bet that the people you met that said the lower river is not worth trying have never canoed the lower river. Everyone has their own ideas but I enjoyed the lower river. The current picks up below St. Louis. There are many new things to see, including big ships and the ocean itself if you go that far.
Thanks for the comment, and congrats on your trip!
Buck
Hey there Buck, I'm jacob Templet. Im 17 and live in the great state of Louisiana, not far from the river itself only about 20 miles, and me and my buddy are considering canoeing the Mississippi for our senior trip after highschool. We take my bateau out every summer for a few fishin' trips around small rivers and bayous down here, if you ever get the chance to canoe down here you should, we love it man.
but all in all your website is veryy helpful, imformative, and inspiring
Hi Jacob,
Thanks for the comment. I'll bet canoeing in Louisiana is awesome! I've only been on the Mississippi River itself in your state but would sure like to paddle around some more of it.
Your plan to canoe the Mississippi sounds like a good one. If you guys do it I guarantee it will be one of the very best summers of your lives.
Have fun!
Buck
Hello Buck,
You are the man. I'm 24 years old and ready to go out and do some of these things. Specifically, I'm beginning my adventures by spending three weeks this summer going down the Mississippi to Dubuque from the Headwaters.
The Apalation Trail sounds Amazing... as I continue to better my skills, I will make bigger and better trips. Thanks for sharing your experiences!
Last summer, I did Day Hikes at Yellowstone; that's a lot of fun.
Hi Geoff,
Thanks for your comment. I'll bet you had fun hiking in Yellowstone. Lots of nice backcountry there.
Good luck on your Mississippi trip!
Buck
Hey Buck. I wanted to thank you for getting so involved in helping all these people take their own adventures down the mississippi, myself included. me and my friend are planning on setting off as soon as summer vacation rolls around, and we're trying to be as prepared as possible. there are only two things i am worried about. 1) my mom says that along the mississippi is a pretty dangerous place (as in theifs, etc.) and 2) when it rains do you just have to paddle through it and maybe sleep soaking wet that night? any information you could offer would be greatly appreciated, as is all the other information that you've already provided to us.
thanks again, Patrick.
Thanks Patrick,
I really do think you tend to make most of your own luck on an adventure like this one. The big danger is the water, but by doing things like wearing your life jacket, staying alert and avoiding boats and dangerous currents you can eliminate most of that risk. The same is true from danger from people. You'll spend most of your time on the water. Use good judgment on where you camp and what you do with your boat and gear when getting supplies and you should be fine.
You'll probably end up paddling in the rain at times. You should have good raingear along. Even so, after hours of rain you'll probably be partially wet. Since you are traveling by water you can definitely have an extra set of dry "sleeping clothes" to put on once you are settled into your tent. Make sure you have good dry bags or waterproof containers of some kind for your sleeping bag and stuff you need to keep dry.
Good luck!
Buck
Hi Buck,
First off my name is Patrick. What you did sounds amazing, and I stumbled upon this site while researching for my own trip this summer. I was wondering, since you've been there, do you think it's possible to go from the olentangy river in ohio to New Orleans in 3 weeks? I understand it will be hard work, but that's all the time I have this summer, and I wanted the opinion of someone who has done something like this before.
Hi Patrick,
You should be able to do the Cairo to the Gulf of Mexico segment in about a month if you paddle lots of hours each day. Having never been on the Ohio I don't know how long that would take.
Good luck!
Buck
Hey there Buck!
This is your fellow CDT thru-hiker Michael Cravens aka Strix. Just wanted to say thanks for the Mississippi River info. Quinn, my dog, and I are planning are own 'thru-paddle' next summer. was hoping to do it this summer but I'm still playing financial catch-up from the hike. Do you have any PCT future plans? Thanks again, you website is not only helpful. but also inspiring!
Strix! I guess it's a small world.
I think a thru-paddle of the Mississippi would be a great adventure to do with your dog.
I guess we pretty much have to do the PCT now, don't we? Actually I probably will try it in two or three or four years or so.
Good luck on the Mississippi!
I am taking a trip down the Illinois River with a good friend of mine in May. I am trying to decide whether the river water is drinkable. Stopping for water seems like it would be a hassle. Why did you decide to get your drinking water in town?
Hi Scott,
Thanks for the question. Here was my thinking: the Mississippi drains a giant area and flows past numerous towns and cities. Although I did on occasion treat and drink Mississippi River water with no ill effects, it just seemed safer and easier to drink "town water." In my canoe it was easy to haul several days worth of drinking water. There was some work in carrying the water to my canoe, but it saved me the effort of treating the water.
Buck- A friend of mine is planning to canoe the Mississippi this fall-09. I am trying to help him plan the trip. I have been to your website which has a LOT of great information. Do you have recommendations about which cities to make stops? Sure would appreciate your insight. Thanks,Sarah
Hi Sarah,
I mostly "winged" my trip. What I did is just watch the maps and kept an eye on my supplies and stop for more supplies when I needed to. A handful of many places I stopped were Bemidji, Grand Rapids, Brainerd, Minneapolis/St. Paul, Hannibal, St. Louis, Cairo and New Orleans. There were numerous others, of course.
Good luck!
Buck
Hey Buck
May I start off by saying you have an great website that is extremely helpful and I am glad I found. Okay well here's the story I am 16 and I live in the Twin Cities. My family owns a cabin about three hours north of the cities in Outing right off highway 6.Well I have always been into hiking adventures, and everything that has to do with the wilderness,(Would love to visit Alaska and hike in the future), but that's besides the point. While I was at my cabin i ended up crossing over the Mississippi in Crosby. It struck me right there, i wanted to paddle not to the gulf but back to the cities. Now I am only able to do this if I have everthing all planned out. What I have figured at the moment is that I want to start in Grand Rapids after the dam and end in Coon Rapids before the dam there, also that way i can avoid some of the busier areas of the river. I also know that I won't be alone, I will have one of my buddies along for the journey. And last I know that i will probably be using an 17 foot aluminum canoe,(would that be alright). Basically everthing else is up in the air. I have a few questions to ask you. First, is the question of time. Do you have an idea about how long and how many days it would take paddling from sun up to sun down. Also will I be able to find areas to camp easily along that stretch, and would it be alright to have fires as long as we cleared out areas for them and made sure to put them out. Also for the length of our trip which of the items from your list would be the most necesary or are all of them important. I have many more questions and all of your advice will be greatly appreciated. I would like to stay intouch with you if possible.
Thank You
-Justin
Hi Justin,
I'm glad you found my site useful.
Your canoe should work fine. As you know from my site I believe in always wearing a life jacket.
On the following page I show how long it took me to travel to various points on the river. I was traveling fairly long days: http://www.bucktrack.com/Missisippi_River_Canoe_Speed.html
You should be able to find campsites fairy easily. There should be fire rings in public camping areas (order the Department of resources maps) http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/watertrails/mississippiriver/three.html and if there are no burning bans campfires would be fine.
The equipment list should apply fairly well as written. You won't need a marine radio if you don't go past Coon Rapids.
Have fun!
Buck
I am planning a canoeing trip from cincinnati to New Orleans. Can you tell me anything I might need to know. I am going to have to buy a canoe and some of my gear. Is there anything you might recommend. I am not a novice when it comes to the outdoors but this new challenge I want to be somewhat prepared for.
thanks, A
That sounds like fun. I'd recommend that you read through all my pages concerning the Mississippi on my website: http://www.bucktrack.com/Canoeing_Down_the_Mississippi.html, then all the comments above. If you still have questions you can ask them here and I'll do my best to answer them.
Buck
Perhaps already asked, but I'm lazy and on a time crunch; what sort of boating permits/license, if any would be needed for this trip? I have some friends that have the summer free next year and we've been talking about doing the Mississippi River from top to bottom. But we're doing it hobo-style, over 3-4 months. We have very little money, and are wondering what sorts of legal fees need to be paid (or deftly avoided) from state to state.
Thanks,
Coyote
nomadcoyote@gmail.com
Hi Coyote,
Thanks for the question. Sorry for the delay in answering, I was out of town.
At the time I made the trip in 2001 all that was required was registering the boat. Since it was a borrowed canoe my friend had already registered it in his home state of Minnesota. You'll also need a fishing license for the appropriate states if you plan to fish.
Have a great trip!
Buck
Buck:
I'm an AT NOBO from 2003. Great trip. My buddy and I stayed at Bear's Den Hostel in VA and found an old National Geographic about the Eastern Intracoastal Waterway. Now that I live in New Orleans, I am torn between a trip from Minn to my adopted home, or doing the Maine - Florida trip. Either way, congrats on all your adventures.
-Snack Attack
GAME 2003
p.s. I read you got your water in towns. Is the river not potable, even with the same kind of filter one would use on the AT?
Buck:
I'm an AT NOBO from 2003. Great trip. My buddy and I stayed at Bear's Den Hostel in VA and found an old National Geographic about the Eastern Intracoastal Waterway. Now that I live in New Orleans, I am torn between a trip from Minn to my adopted home, or doing the Maine - Florida trip. Either way, congrats on all your adventures.
-Snack Attack
GAME 2003
p.s. I read you got your water in towns. Is the river not potable, even with the same kind of filter one would use on the AT?
Hi Snake Attack,
That's great that you did the AT. The Bear's Den Hostel is a cool place, isn't it?
It was my impression that the water above the Twin Cities was probably OK if treated with normal backpacking methods. Below that point my thinking was that chemical impurities may become a greater problem. Mainly, though, is that it was simple getting good drinking water along the way. I did on occasion treat and drink river water below St. Louis with no apparent ill effects.
Best of luck whichever journey you undertake!
Buck
Has any one u know ever paddeled up the river
While I was going down the river I ran across a guy who had kayaked up the river from Mile 0 to Lake Itasca. Amazing! I'm sure one of the keys to success for a trip like that is taking advantage of slack water or even back currents near the shore. Incredible accomplishment either way.
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